Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:27 pm

Yes, it is, although I'd be surprised if you can find one. Microsoft stopped selling it a while ago, and then someone bought rights to distribute on Steam - the one on Steam is called "Steam Edition"

Come to think of it, "Steam Edition" does NOT let me debug... I didn't think of that. So if you can find a Microsoft version in Best Buy or anywhere else, that would be perfect.

I have both - Microsoft's and Steam's, and they both work with my add-on... in fact I'm intermittently using both.
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby Julio Jerez » Fri Dec 07, 2018 3:56 pm

what do you mean does not let you debug, you are not debug their code you are debugging you dll,
can you set a break point it your dll?
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:07 pm

Julio Jerez wrote:what do you mean does not let you debug, you are not debug their code you are debugging you dll,
can you set a break point it your dll?


Yes, I can set a breakpoint in my code no problem, and probably in Newton (but I haven't tried yet, I first ask in this Forum before I'd try to "fix" anything in Newton). But that's only when I run Microsoft's FSX.

There is something they did with Steam Edition that prevents FSX starting in debug mode... even if I only want to debug my own code. Basically, when you hit F5 in Visual Studio, there is something that prevents FSX:SE starting up. There is a message that pops up, but I forgot what it says. I can check if you need to see it.

I went on line to check in one of the FSX dev forums, and it was confirmed by members, the publishers of FSX:SE disabled debugging - not sure why. I am not an expert in this, but since my FSX can be debugged, and FSX:SE cannot (with the exactly same setup) I take that as confirmation.

EDIT: Looks like I forgot about this: here is my post, asking about this on FSX Developer forum, and there IS a solution after all :roll: :mrgreen:
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby Julio Jerez » Fri Dec 07, 2018 4:49 pm

we do not need to debug their code, we only need ty be able to debug you dll and newton.
if you can see break point the that's seem possible.
Only managed code can prevent people form debuging dlls, that my beef with unity, but I do not think MFS is managed code.
I think we are fine. I will get the copy tomorrow.
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:27 pm

Julio Jerez wrote:we do not need to debug their code, we only need ty be able to debug you dll and newton.
if you can see break point the that's seem possible.
Only managed code can prevent people form debuging dlls, that my beef with unity, but I do not think MFS is managed code.
I think we are fine. I will get the copy tomorrow.


No, we don't need the FSX code, nor would we be able to get the debug version :wink:

Yes, we are fine with both versions... as per my edit to my last post, the problem with Steam version was that it was complaining that it needs to be started within Steam (for copy protection), not by any other means (as would VS command be)... but there is a workaround.
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby Julio Jerez » Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:08 pm

the only place that I see has the product is Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Flight ... B00XHGCX36

you say the steam version is 24.00 but that request to be plug to steam to run it?

I do not really like to depend of stuff like Steam on my personal computer, that stuff fill the system with ads and stuff like that.

If I order form amazon it, I think the have digital downloads. bu the question will those work with your stuff.
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:37 pm

Julio Jerez wrote:the only place that I see has the product is Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Flight ... B00XHGCX36


No, that's not it - that's just Amazon selling a code for Steam download. If you want a non Steam, it would be FSX Gold or Deluxe edition (which I have). See links below. Since MS stopped publishing them, Disc versions became quite rare and somewhat valuable... I think there is only ONE on amazon brand new, for $107...

Deluxe edition, used:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing ... xe+edition

Gold edition, used:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing ... ld+edition

Julio Jerez wrote:you say the steam version is 24.00 but that request to be plug to steam to run it?

I do not really like to depend of stuff like Steam on my personal computer, that stuff fill the system with ads and stuff like that.


Yes unfortunately you have to have Steam service installed... but it is not that bad, it doesn't bombard me with ads. Steam is pretty serious and respectable platform. I'll be selling my simulator through Steam, actually it is in their "store" right now, labeled as "coming soon" :wink:

Julio Jerez wrote:If I order form amazon it, I think the have digital downloads. bu the question will those work with your stuff.


To be honest, I am not sure if this Amazon version will require Steam to be active. This is the first time I see this. It has foreign language labeling (including Russian) which makes me think it may be Steam edition for countries where Steam isn't active, or something like that. In any case, try asking a question explicitly, before you order: Is Steam service required to run this game, or is it just a download, with a key?





Hope this helps!
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:45 pm

Just a bit off topic - there are a few other "versions" of FSX, most notably, none other than Lockheed Martin, who bought the rights from Microsoft way back, and they are pursuing an "industry" version of it, called "Prepar3D"...

check it out:
https://www.prepar3d.com/

It is quite a capable simulation platform, and they are using it for a wide variety of in house procedures and training for various platforms. They cover atmospheric aircraft and they have a ballistic weapons module, but, oddly enough, (Being a major space contractor) no spaceflight module - which is precisely what I am developing. I haven't tested it, but I see no reason why my module wouldn't work on it, since they support Microsoft FSX SDK-created content (which is ALL I use!)

So, you never know - perhaps we'll see FSX SpacePort running Newton on Lockheed Martin's simulation platform one day :wink:
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby Julio Jerez » Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:27 pm

The one thing I am curios about is how the physic can be overiten, I thought those thong were all about. Physical simulations. What does the simulator do?
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:37 pm

FSX has its own flight model, for airplanes, and very very basic collision engine, basically, boxes.

When FSX was published in 2006, it introduced SimConnect, an API that exposes a lot of internal workings of the FSX. Part of it is ability to "freeze" FSX flight model (make FSX ignore it) and let an external DLL control the positioning and orientation of the objects in the FSX ecosystem - and that's basically what I do with Newton. I use it just as you are using the visual display system in demoSandbox.

I could as easily create a ship simulator or driving simulator using FSX and Newton... :wink:

The main reason that I didn't go with some other game engine or create my own is, FSX re-creates the whole earth, with topography, procedural textures, water surfaces, calendar system, weather system, atmospheric model, seasons, etc... everything you need to have a proper flight simulator and now, space simulator. That would be a huge task to re-create...
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Fri Dec 07, 2018 10:44 pm

Actually, when I announced spaceflight module to flight simulator community, some people were interested if I could improve collision system for the flight simulator (while keeping flight model) using Newton physics engine. I answered that I didn't think that was possible because Newton governs the motion of the bodies and the resulting collisions, which means, all or nothing. The only way to do that would be to re-write the flight model itself using Newton. And they loved that idea, because FSX flight model was rather simplistic :roll:
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby Julio Jerez » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:09 pm

I do not have time to get the flight sim, I try to get it today of tomorrow Michio.
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Re: Problem in dgWorldDynamicUpdate::BuildClusters

Postby misho » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:14 pm

Thanks Julio - no problem, this is not a huge rush. As long as it is on your "to-do" list :wink:
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