OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

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OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby gam » Tue Dec 16, 2008 6:16 pm

Maybe this new general-purpose parallel programming language would be useful to accelerate NGD
on modern multi-core and stream gpu processors? Looks like the holy grail to me.

Check it out here: http://www.khronos.org/opencl/


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Re: OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby Dave Gravel » Wed Dec 17, 2008 2:29 am

It seen good, but newton is already a multicore system.
The gain from this tool and parallel method is more with your 3d or ai and other process like this.

You can see the intel demo here using a very basic parallel implementation method.
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=4578


if you like to experiement more about it:
Yes it seen to give more fps but in reallity the physics have a internal limite too, and you need too deal with it anyway in a sence.
The best to know this limite make a personal newton bench but remove all graphic rendering link to your object and create many many objects.
On this way you can see the physics limite in stack's mode and this speed is real because it render nothing.
Now active the 3d visual and do the same test, normally it is suposed to come lower with the 3d visual actived.
The parallel method is use to remove this slowdown by push the physics and graphics is separate process.
And after you see the physics can get the limite objects count and the 3d visual is rendered with the real newton fps limite by object count in stack's,
and you gain more fps and process for other stuff.

In conclusion this is surely good for all user having a minimum engine implemented with newton and 3d and more...
I only talk here from what I have test about similar method but maybe i'm wrong in some case too, about this OpenCL.
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Re: OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby Julio Jerez » Wed Dec 17, 2008 12:07 pm

gam wrote:Maybe this new general-purpose parallel programming language would be useful to accelerate NGD
on modern multi-core and stream gpu processors? Looks like the holy grail to me.

Check it out here: http://www.khronos.org/opencl/
Greg



I would not hold my breath waiting for the Khronos group to come with practical solution to anything.

The Khronos group team is like dishonest politicians of the software industry, you the king that always jumps in front of a parade to take control of what other people are doing and take credit for it.

Openly was very good up until the specifications were made by the OpenGL Architecture Review Board, but ever since the big companies like Microsoft and Silicon Graphics left the committee because of the anarchy create by a whole lot of other companies the API because stagnant but stable.
But when the Khonos group took over just ruined the specifications.
This is also the group the came up with Collada, perhaps the worst, more pedantic and useless format I have ever seen.
The only thing you can expect from the incompetents at Khronos group is they taking good project by other people ruined and then calling it industry standard.

Knowing this is coming from the Khronos group I and not going to even bother reading it, I am sure it will promise wonders in the draft but it will deliver very little.

What hardware had the Khronos group made so that they can take the task of creation a multicores language? What do they know about the internal of any OS?
What do they know about the Cell, the Xenon, the Intel I7, the new GPU, etc.
What they know is the same thing you and I know if you are working with any of this platforms.


I am no particularly happy with the current way threading is handled with the current OS like XP, vista, Mac and Linux.
The problem with multi cores is that Microsoft created the thread API for windows and the open source community made pThread in response, as usual pThread is much more inferior to native windows treading but the is what you get wit t he group take a take they are no qualified to take.
A new threading API with much lower latencies is need it, the OpenMp turn out to be inadequate for many type of tasks, plus it is not batter than native threading because it is buid on top of the current threading interface.

What I can tell you is that the Khronos group in no way shape or form has the qualification to take on a task like that.
A task like that is better done by a real company like Microsoft or Intel, no by the moronic groups that are only in the way of everybody else.

Let the Khronos group fu*k themselves and take somebody else for a fool, they are not take any of my time anymore.
I can guarantee you that these OpenCL is the open source version of Cuda, only way more medicre and ineficient. They cannot see a project they cannot plagiarize.
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Re: OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby Dave Gravel » Wed Dec 17, 2008 1:30 pm

PS: I talk here only about the parallel method in general.
Anyway the gain in final is not really important, and it causing more problem to deal with your code and simulation.
From my experience by testing the intel method it is good only when the physics is use with some limitation and control.
Again from my experience,
exemple with vehicle simulation and fast simulation it is hard to syncronize all process to make it stable and compatible with all computer type.
It is a lot more hard to get a stable simulation and more if you using a game loop to update the physcis.
You search a nice physics solution, if you can read this message you're at the good place :wink:
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Re: OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby Julio Jerez » Sun Feb 08, 2009 3:35 pm

Ok I buy, where is dowload place for this OpenCL.

for all I see this is just Vaporware.
It is was real I give a shot, but all find is teh ususl sheer leader talliing aboput some that do no really exist.
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Re: OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby RedDrake » Sun Feb 08, 2009 6:22 pm

AFAIK OpenCL is vaporware right now, but that will change when vendors (Apple, Intel, ATI/NV) release their implemenations, and while I share your discontent with Khonos, I think you should also be aware that OpenCL was not started by Khonos group, IIRC it was just a marketing/legal thing by Apple, since they originally started it. They have seen that GPGPU is going to be important in the future, and in order not to stay behind Microsoft and DX11 compute shader they created OpenCL.
But if they made it Mac specific then they would lose many potential developers and applications, so they wanted it to be "open standard". So the way I see it is Apple will remain the driving force behind OpenCL development and Khonos will just be there to legally release the specs as "open standard" and consult with implementation vendors, I doubt they will let OpenCL lose until it's actually usable, and my faith in Apple is a lot stronger than Khonos. Actually any company/organization is higher than Khonos after the whole GL3 fiasco.
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Re: OpenCL would make NGD acceleration possible?

Postby Dave Gravel » Sun Feb 08, 2009 6:49 pm

You search a nice physics solution, if you can read this message you're at the good place :wink:
OrionX3D Projects & Demos:
https://orionx3d.sytes.net
https://www.facebook.com/dave.gravel1
https://www.youtube.com/user/EvadLevarg/videos
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